Donald Trump

[geordief]

Trump doesn't care about his detractors . He is focused on building his reputation.

 

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-38021820

 

Still ,all politicians lie ,don't they?

[Ten oz]

Trump doesn't care about his detractors . He is focused on building his reputation.

 

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-38021820

 

Still ,all politicians lie ,don't they?

Lie - a false statement made with deliberate intent to deceive; an intentional untruth; a falsehood.

 

All politicians lie is a statement that is universally agreed with but is not necessarily true in my opinion. I think many people confuse, intentionally or by lack of context,the difference between something which is inaccurate and is a lie. By define for something someone says to be a lie they (the person saying it) must know that its false. Simply saying something that's false isn't lying unless it is done on purpose. In my opinion saying that all politicians tell falsehoods in more accurate than saying they all lie.

 

An example would be political debates about evolution . Many falsehoods are said by politicians on the issue. However ignorant some of those falsehoods may be they are not lies because the politicians saying them legitimately believe the falsehoods they are repeating. They are uneducated on the issue and perhaps ignorant/arrogant for even speaking on matters they don't know but are not liers.

 

Donald Trump is a lier. When the dates for the debates were released he complained about the first debate being during football games and claimed the NFL contacted him about it. The NFL can forward and said that never happened and Trump admitted that it wasn't true. That was a lie. Trump had knowing said something false. After being brief by U.S. intelligence that Russian hackers were responsible for the hacks against the DNC Trump repeatedly argued both that we (U.S.) did not know who had performed the hacks and that it may have been China. That was a lie. Trump knew both implications were false and argued them anyways. Trump claims he cannot release his taxes because he is under audit. The IRS released a statement several month ago stating the audits do not prohibit or are effected in anyway by someone releasing their taxes. Trump knows he could release his taxes but is saying otherwise, it is a lie. Trump claimed to have been a show a video by U.S. intelligence of cash being given to Iran then U.S. intel said it wasn't true and Trump admitted it never happened. That was a lie. Again, Trump has knowingly said something he knew to be false. The examples of Trump lying are endless.

 

I honestly cannot think of any politician that lies the way Donald Trump lies. Sarah Palin says many stupid things but I am under the impression she honestly believes most of it to various extents. President Obama is careful with his words and can be guarded or purposely vague at times but I honestly am not aware of any lies he has told. Ted Cruz has zero integrity and supports many positions which are completely disagree with but he isn't a bold face lier. Donald Trump is a bold face lier to an extent that it does politics a disservice to normalize it by saying "all politicians lie".

[geordief]

Lie - a false statement made with deliberate intent to deceive; an intentional untruth; a falsehood.

 

All politicians lie is a statement that is universally agreed with but is not necessarily true in my opinion. I think many people confuse, intentionally or by lack of context,the difference between something which is inaccurate and is a lie. By define for something someone says to be a lie they (the person saying it) must know that its false. Simply saying something that's false isn't lying unless it is done on purpose. In my opinion saying that all politicians tell falsehoods in more accurate than saying they all lie.

 

An example would be political debates about evolution . Many falsehoods are said by politicians on the issue. However ignorant some of those falsehoods may be they are not lies because the politicians saying them legitimately believe the falsehoods they are repeating. They are uneducated on the issue and perhaps ignorant/arrogant for even speaking on matters they don't know but are not liers.

 

Donald Trump is a lier. When the dates for the debates were released he complained about the first debate being during football games and claimed the NFL contacted him about it. The NFL can forward and said that never happened and Trump admitted that it wasn't true. That was a lie. Trump had knowing said something false. After being brief by U.S. intelligence that Russian hackers were responsible for the hacks against the DNC Trump repeatedly argued both that we (U.S.) did not know who had performed the hacks and that it may have been China. That was a lie. Trump knew both implications were false and argued them anyways. Trump claims he cannot release his taxes because he is under audit. The IRS released a statement several month ago stating the audits do not prohibit or are effected in anyway by someone releasing their taxes. Trump knows he could release his taxes but is saying otherwise, it is a lie. Trump claimed to have been a show a video by U.S. intelligence of cash being given to Iran then U.S. intel said it wasn't true and Trump admitted it never happened. That was a lie. Again, Trump has knowingly said something he knew to be false. The examples of Trump lying are endless.

 

I honestly cannot think of any politician that lies the way Donald Trump lies. Sarah Palin says many stupid things but I am under the impression she honestly believes most of it to various extents. President Obama is careful with his words and can be guarded or purposely vague at times but I honestly am not aware of any lies he has told. Ted Cruz has zero integrity and supports many positions which are completely disagree with but he isn't a bold face lier. Donald Trump is a bold face lier to an extent that it does politics a disservice to normalize it by saying "all politicians lie".

I was being sarcastic. It comes easy these days (dripping slow) The "All politicians are liars" line is a recruiting sergeant for passive acceptors of Trump

[Phi for All]

I honestly cannot think of any politician that lies the way Donald Trump lies.

 

It's because he's lying like a salesman, not a politician. He's lying to set the stage, so when he tells the truth you'll grab at it like a nugget of gold and give it more weight than you would have if he hadn't set the stage with all those lies.

 

It works in a Hollywood sort of way. We were blown away by Spielberg's dinosaurs in Jurassic Park, and equally blown away when we learned that there was only 6 minutes of CGI in the whole movie.

 

Trump lies for the same reason a salesman might start bidding exorbitantly high, in hopes that it will increase the final offer. He suggests ludicrous things that shock people, in hopes that they'll view what he actually does in a better light. He'll get border security that's merely unnecessary and expensive, instead of preposterous and crippling. He'll settle for harmful and costly because he's been spouting off about deadly and ruinous.

 

Unfortunately for us, I think the rest of the world is not so gullible as half the US.

[Ten oz]

 

It's because he's lying like a salesman, not a politician. He's lying to set the stage, so when he tells the truth you'll grab at it like a nugget of gold and give it more weight than you would have if he hadn't set the stage with all those lies.

 

It works in a Hollywood sort of way. We were blown away by Spielberg's dinosaurs in Jurassic Park, and equally blown away when we learned that there was only 6 minutes of CGI in the whole movie.

 

Trump's lies for the same reason a salesman might start bidding exorbitantly high, in hopes that it will increase the final offer. He suggests ludicrous things that shock people, in hopes that they'll view what he actually does in a better light. He'll get border security that's merely unnecessary and expensive, instead of preposterous and crippling. He'll settle for harmful and costly because he's been spouting off about deadly and ruinous.

 

Unfortunately for us, I think the rest of the world is not so gullible as half the US.

I hope it isn't actually half.

[Phi for All]

I hope it isn't actually half.

 

I can only go by the ones intelligent enough to vote.

[swansont]

I'm waiting for the outrage that the Tumpster has been taking calls from foreign officials on his personal (i.e. not secure in any way) phone. And that since he's not placed his assets in a blind trust and foreign delegates are being encouraged to stay at his hotels, that there's pay-for-play going on. You know, all the stuff that people were outraged about Hillary when even a suggestion of impropriety arose.

[geordief]

I'm waiting for the outrage that the Tumpster has been taking calls from foreign officials on his personal (i.e. not secure in any way) phone. And that since he's not placed his assets in a blind trust and foreign delegates are being encouraged to stay at his hotels, that there's pay-for-play going on. You know, all the stuff that people were outraged about Hillary when even a suggestion of impropriety arose.

I heard that on the BBC.It was said with a knowing world weary smile.

 

I am sure we can "get over it" . After all "trust me" and "I know this folks" ,"this is going to be good"

[Endy0816]

To be fair, he isn't in a formal position yet.

[geordief]

To be fair, he isn't in a formal position yet.

He has met the Japanese PM with his daughter seemingly present at the conversation.

 

Have the mental health issues regarding Trump been "shelved"? Is it likely that he has psychological weaknesses such as an inability to face reality and to take responsibility for his positions.

 

Is he going to have to be "babied" through his term and is he so thin skinned that everyone will have to walk on eggshells when dealing with him?

Edited November 20, 2016 by geordief

[swansont]

I heard that on the BBC.It was said with a knowing world weary smile.

 

I am sure we can "get over it" . After all "trust me" and "I know this folks" ,"this is going to be good"

 

 

I'm not talking about Trump himself; he might not even see the contradiction. I'm talking about the hypocrisy of the supporters.

 

Also on the table is increasing the deficit. Only a problem when the democrats are in office, apparently.

[geordief]

 

 

I'm not talking about Trump himself; he might not even see the contradiction. I'm talking about the hypocrisy of the supporters.

 

Also on the table is increasing the deficit. Only a problem when the democrats are in office, apparently.

Supporters presumably see this as pragmatism.

 

(all politicians lie ,so why can't they?)

 

Is Trump their "useful idiot" ?

 

Politics is the art of the possible.

[Ten oz]

 

It's because he's lying like a salesman, not a politician. He's lying to set the stage, so when he tells the truth you'll grab at it like a nugget of gold and give it more weight than you would have if he hadn't set the stage with all those lies.

 

It works in a Hollywood sort of way. We were blown away by Spielberg's dinosaurs in Jurassic Park, and equally blown away when we learned that there was only 6 minutes of CGI in the whole movie.

 

Trump lies for the same reason a salesman might start bidding exorbitantly high, in hopes that it will increase the final offer. He suggests ludicrous things that shock people, in hopes that they'll view what he actually does in a better light. He'll get border security that's merely unnecessary and expensive, instead of preposterous and crippling. He'll settle for harmful and costly because he's been spouting off about deadly and ruinous.

 

Unfortunately for us, I think the rest of the world is not so gullible as half the US.

I actually don't think Trump lies like a salesman. I think he lies like a spoiled child. He doesn't get away with it because of any special technique but rather because conservatives don't care. In my opinion conservatives, broadly, have exposed themselves as being entirely dishonest and singularly interested in control.

 

Republicans in Congress repealed the ACA (aka Obamacare) 50 times and claimed it was the single most terrible piece of legislation in history yet now from Trump all the way down to conservatives in this thread everyone basically want to keep the ACA with only minor changes. In years past conservatives have cried about social issues using the bible and religion as a baseline. Yet Donald Trump clearly isn't religious and cares nothing about the Bible. Trump has children with 3 different women, brags about celebrity and the sex it affords him, and a proven lair. The holier than thou conservatives clearly don't care. They spent the last 8yrs crying till blue in the face about the way Obama ruled as a king. Meanwhile Trump regularly answers technical policy questions by dismissively saying "I will decide at the time" and "If I like what I see". His policy positions are purely based on how he personally feels moment to moment and his supporters are fine with it. They are fine with Trump building a physical wall, a virtual wall using technology, or just not building a wall at all. It really just doesn't matter. Trump can reverse DACA and deport those young people or just let them stay. It really just doesn't matter to a Trump supporter. Getting the win is all that mattered.

 

It is unforgivable in my opinion. Conservatives have spent so much time lying to the detriment of the country. ACA could work better than it does, could be helping more people than it does, at lower rates, and etc but conservatives went to war because with just to score points. That goes for nearly every policy. We have a major party who purposefully sabotages policy purely to score political points and doesn't care what impact it has on peoples lives. The kids here under DACA could have been made citizens years ago but Republicans cried. Now they have power, who knows, Trump is back and further on the issue and ultimately his supporters will accept whatever he decides as if real lives are not hanging is the balance. It is disgusting to watch!

Edited November 20, 2016 by Ten oz

[Endy0816]

While him being elected President is nigh certain, he is just another citizen at the moment.

[geordief]

I actually don't think Trump lies like a salesman. I think he lies like a spoiled child. He doesn't get away with it because of any special technique but rather because conservatives don't care. In my opinion conservatives, broadly, have exposed themselves as being entirely dishonest and singularly interested in control.

 

Republicans in Congress repealed the ACA (aka Obamacare) 50 times and claimed it was the single most terrible piece of legislation in history yet now from Trump all the way down to conservatives in this thread everyone basically want to keep the ACA with only minor changes. In years past conservatives have cried about social issues using the bible and religion as a baseline. Yet Donald Trump clearly isn't religious and cares nothing about the Bible. Trump has children with 3 different women, brags about celebrity and the sex it affords him, and a proven lair. The holier than thou conservatives clearly don't care. They spent the last 8yrs crying till blue in the face about the way Obama ruled as a king. Meanwhile Trump regularly answers technical policy questions by dismissively saying "I will decide at the time" and "If I like what I see". His policy positions are purely based on how he personally feels moment to moment and his supporters are fine with it. They are fine with Trump building a physical wall, a virtual wall using technology, or just not building a wall at all. It really just doesn't matter. Trump can reverse DACA and deport those young people or just let them stay. It really just doesn't matter to a Trump supporter. Getting the win is all that mattered.

 

It is unforgivable in my opinion. Conservatives have spent so much time lying to the detriment of the country. ACA could work better than it does, could be helping more people than it does, at lower rates, and etc but conservatives went to war because with just to score points. That goes for nearly every policy. We have a major party who purposefully sabotages policy purely to score political points and doesn't care what impact it has on peoples lives. The kids here under DACA could have been made citizens years ago but Republicans cried. Now they have power, who knows, Trump is back and further on the issue and ultimately his supporters will accept whatever he decides as if real lives are not hanging is the balance. It is disgusting to watch!

Something of a straw man? Are both Republican and Democrat parties actually spent forces now ? Has the political division and refusal to co operate over the past decade brought down both parties so that now the political system will have to start from scratch (even if the two parties continue for now as "empty shells"? )

[Ten oz]

Something of a straw man? Are both Republican and Democrat parties actually spent forces now ? Has the political division and refusal to co operate over the past decade brought down both parties so that now the political system will have to start from scratch (even if the two parties continue for now as "empty shells"? )

Democrats worked with Bush. The notion that both parties behave this way simply is an incorrect one. Bush was not filibustered to a record extent, prevented from making judicial appointments, heckled during the State of the Union, and etc by Democrats.

[geordief]

Democrats worked with Bush. The notion that both parties behave this way simply is an incorrect one. Bush was not filibustered to a record extent, prevented from making judicial appointments, heckled during the State of the Union, and etc by Democrats.

I agree that the lack of co operation became pathological under Obama (from the Republicans) but I felt at the time that there had been bile from the other side towards the Republican under Bush and so they "got their own back" under Obama.

 

They went far too far and I wonder now is the system entirely broken with no co operation possible.

 

If I was a US citizen I don't know that I could advocate co operation with the coming regime which has a distinctly sinister look to it.

 

It is a rock and a hard place.

[Ten oz]

I agree that the lack of co operation became pathological under Obama (from the Republicans) but I felt at the time that there had been bile from the other side towards the Republican under Bush and so they "got their own back" under Obama.

 

They went far too far and I wonder now is the system entirely broken with no co operation possible.

 

If I was a US citizen I don't know that I could advocate co operation with the coming regime which has a distinctly sinister look to it.

 

It is a rock and a hard place.

I agree that Republicans felt they were just returning the favor, so to say. However that came from an unreasonable place. Bush got the votes he wanted on War, tax cuts, Justices, and etc. The push back Bush experienced, though strong at times, was all mostly warranted in retrospect. Bush did go to war based on incorrect information, tortured, warrantless wire taps, exploded the deficit while keeping the wars off the books, and etc, etc.

I advocate for cooperation where there is compromise to be found. If Republicans want to help make the ACA work now rather than just complain about it , fine, I am for cooperation. It they finally want real immigration reform, fine, I am all for it. However, where there is no cooperation to be had I hope democrats fight. I hope if attempts are made to roll back envirnmental protection Democrats fight. I hope if Trump attempts to put troops into a foriegn conflict Democrats fight. I do not want Democrats to merely accept that there must be compromises found for everything.

Edited November 20, 2016 by Ten oz

[iNow]

Yes, republicans did those things to an unreasonable extreme extent, and it worked. They won.

 

They won the electoral college for presidency. They won the senate. They won the house. They won most State houses. They won most governorships. They will control the judiciary.

 

Yes, they did those things and they won because they did.

[Ten oz]

Yes, republicans did those things to an unreasonable extreme extent, and it worked. They won.

 

They won the electoral college for presidency. They won the senate. They won the house. They won most State houses. They won most governorships. They will control the judiciary.

 

Yes, they did those things and they won because they did.

Yes, and without popular support no less. Unless progressive are able to find the energy to stand against conservatives with the same single minded and united focus I don't see anything changing. The whole "Democrats fall in love while Republicans fall in line" played out this year as may progressives allowed themselve to accept that Hillary Clinton wasn't worth supporting.

[waitforufo]

... as may progressives allowed themselve to accept that Hillary Clinton wasn't worth supporting.

Maybe they just couldn't get behind Hillary's "Believe in someone you don't believe" campaign slogan.

[Ten oz]

Maybe they just couldn't get behind Hillary's "Believe in someone you don't believe" campaign slogan.

Right, why bother getting 90% of what you want when you can have ZERO.

[Airbrush]

Does anyone know what Trump's strategy against ISIS could be? He says he will get tough with ISIS, will do it very quickly, and he knows more than the generals, which I suppose means he has listened to Gen Flynn and maybe some other dissenting generals or military analysts. He also says that the battle of Mosul did not have the element of surprise. General MacArther and Patton would be "spinning in their graves" if they knew we didn't surprise ISIS. It seems to me what Trump plans to do is to send spies or drones into occupied territory to figure out where the ISIS leaders are located, then carpet bomb that entire area, and to hell with collateral damage. Do you think that is Trump's ISIS strategy?

[geordief]

Does anyone know what Trump's strategy against ISIS could be? He says he will get tough with ISIS, will do it very quickly, and he knows more than the generals, which I suppose means he has listened to Gen Flynn and maybe some other dissenting generals or military analysts. He also says that the battle of Mosul did not have the element of surprise. General MacArther and Patton would be "spinning in their graves" if they knew we didn't surprise ISIS. It seems to me what Trump plans to do is to send spies or drones into occupied territory to figure out where the ISIS leaders are located, then carpet bomb that entire area, and to hell with collateral damage. Do you think that is Trump's ISIS strategy?

I think "to hell with collateral damage" might be the cornerstone of his policy. I can't imagine what he might flesh it out with.

 

I have about .1% confidence in his strategy when it is revealed.

 

Hopefully this will open his "supporters'" eyes to their busted flush but sadly we may have to wait for this to become evident

 

EDIT :I forgot he is hoping to let the Russians do most of the "work".(the new allies?)

Edited November 21, 2016 by geordief

[iNow]

Does anyone know what Trump's strategy against ISIS could be?

Pretty much the whole world knows now.

 

Trump had a meeting with candidate for Secretary of the Department of Homeland Security, Kris Koback, this weekend at the Trump estate. Kobach took the plan into his meeting with Trump and left it on the outside of his folder facing outward for all to see when that meeting was finished. Photographers grabbed a photo of his plan for the first year and now it's everywhere for all to see (link below).

 

I don't know about you, but I'm feeling all safe and secure already and am glad we finally have people who know what they're doing taking the reigns of power and control.

 

https://twitter.com/schezar/status/800772691531808768/photo/1