Does pore speeling sygnifeye ignorense?

[iNow]

Frequently see poor spelling from those with whom I ideologically disagree. I also know that spelling is often a neurobiological challenge for otherwise very intelligent people, and further stipulate that I likely have a selection bias (wherein I don't recall / notice the spelling errors of those with whom I agree and/or tend to align as much as I notice it among those with whom I tend to disagree).

 

My conjecture here is that, for most people, poor spelling can serve as a proxy of intelligence, one suggestive to readers that the individual contributing/posting doesn't read much.

 

From that core, I then make the (what I deem to be rational and justified) assumption that a person who doesn't read much tends more often to be less informed, less educated, less practiced at critical thought, and subsequently less often worth much attention or consideration/reflection.

 

Perhaps, though, this approach ignores too much of the human condition, discards too many elements of social interaction, focuses too exclusively on text based media. Perhaps there are other flaws in such an approach.

 

So, what say you? Is this line of thinking so simplistic as to be remedially wrong and largely unhelpful, or is there perhaps a smidgen of merit in this idea, a modicum of validity, a few ounces of meat on this proverbial bone?

 

Does poor spelling in our modern data driven world serve as a reasonable proxy for the ignorance/intelligence of the writer?

[Robittybob1]

One thing I've noticed is the number of threads that have serious spelling errors in their title. That to me makes a thread very suspect from the beginning. I prefer a title that catches the eye and expresses what the subject is about.

 

If there are spelling errors in the text being quoted I will correct them. I make mistakes and often I find people joke about my errors, but personally I wouldn't do that to anyone else.

 

Writing skills and conversation skills may go hand in hand.

You are very fluent in your writing, and I wish I could do the same. The more you post the more skilled you become at being 100% clear in what you are saying.

There are many factors in a person's background that has shaped a person, it may not just be intelligence but intelligence would certainly rank highly when it comes to writing skills.

[studiot]

A good discussion to have, +1

 

You have obviously been reading the later posts in this thread

 

http://www.scienceforums.net/topic/93683-whats-the-definition-for-this-law/

 

Your next challenge will be reading a Doctor's hanwritten notes.

 

[swansont]

While in general I do associate poor spelling with ignorance/lower intelligence and if along with the poor spelling comes poor grammar, I definitely make the association. That said, it's also true that one of the smartest people I know is a poor speller.

 

(edit: one of my favorites from this person is the "bonified need" phrase in a purchasing document)

[imatfaal]

Frequently see poor spelling from those with whom I ideologically disagree. I also know that spelling is often a neurobiological challenge for otherwise very intelligent people, and further stipulate that I likely have a selection bias (wherein I don't recall / notice the spelling errors of those with whom I agree and/or tend to align as much as I notice it among those with whom I tend to disagree).

 

My conjecture here is that, for most people, poor spelling can serve as a proxy of intelligence, one suggestive to readers that the individual contributing/posting doesn't read much.

 

From that core, I then make the (what I deem to be rational and justified) assumption that a person who doesn't read much tends more often to be less informed, less educated, less practiced at critical thought, and subsequently less often worth much attention or consideration/reflection.

 

Perhaps, though, this approach ignores too much of the human condition, discards too many elements of social interaction, focuses too exclusively on text based media. Perhaps there are other flaws in such an approach.

 

So, what say you? Is this line of thinking so simplistic as to be remedially wrong and largely unhelpful, or is there perhaps a smidgen of merit in this idea, a modicum of validity, a few ounces of meat on this proverbial bone?

 

Does poor spelling in our modern data driven world serve as a reasonable proxy for the ignorance/intelligence of the writer?

 

I am not sure if it does or if it should; but I can guarantee that poor spelling is used a metric for judging competence in many areas in which a good command of language, grammar, and spelling would not seem important. This judgment is not the more obvious "you cannot spell therefore you are [....]" - but the more reasonable and devastating "this is an important piece of work and yet you failed to check the most easily checked part". Correct spelling and grammar signify nothing; but errors demonstrate sloppiness - and, in many areas, that can be worse than ignorance.

 

I admit to being guilty of this - my spelling is atrocious - but I check and recheck everything; and I expect others to do the same. This leads to anything from forum posts to presentations being free from (too many) errors and also reflexive checking of any text in front of me for mistakes.

[Endy0816]

I think it shows focus level. If you are unable to focus on your writing, your argument may also suffer. Phones are probably when you really need to be careful these days.

[DrP]

@imatfaal: Mine too - my spelling can be atrocious! Although it seems ok today! lol. Sometimes I have to retype a word 6 or 7 times and still get it wrong... I have to type it into a spell checker or google even for the spelling. Usually I have put an I before an e or the other way round or an SC for a cc or a cc rather than sc or an ss rather than just an s etc.. sometimes, when I am tired especially, it can REALLY get me down that I have to look up how to spell something at my age... I have been like it all my life... even very short 'easy' words on some days and other days fine - Stupid? Maybe, but I managed to get a science PhD anyway, back in the days when we would be marked down in Chemistry for poor grammar or spelling during written answers too.

 

Basically, I have always believed that I could be partially dyslexic, therefore, I forgive myself easily if I start feeling very dumb after failing to write something.

 

 

(Yay!! only one word needed correcting in the whole lot - I'm having a good day!)

Edited February 25, 2016 by DrP

[Externet]

In my opinion, the English language being an spoken language in its roots is what mostly contributes to spelling errors. Whoever decided the current way to write a word in English is the correct way, was a senseless decision. Sorry, mister Shakespeare. English is very screwed up.

The need to memorize the spelling of each word was a surprise to me learning this language. Do not know if other languages are alike, with 'spelling bee' contests.

 

Phonetic languages are not like that. They are pronounced exactly as written, they are written exactly as heard; with every letter having one and only one sound. No problem in writing words never heard before, nor saying something as first found in written.

 

Second is the interest of the writer on doing things right.

Do not see the above as related to 'intelligence'

 

'law', 'knife' are two of thousand examples which make no sense. To me, should be 'lo' , 'naif'

[dimreepr]

I doubt anyone on this site would consider my English skills to be anything other than mediocre, so I use a spell/grammar checker to compose my posts, neither do I have any real academic qualification or talent.

 

What intelligence I do have is in understanding myself and, I think, others.

 

There seems to be many different categories of intelligence and the world is a better place because of it, for instance my sister has a PhD in the sciences but will almost always consult me with her problems.

 

For me arrogance denotes a lack of intelligence but even then they often make good leaders/money.

[CharonY]

 

 

 

but I check and recheck everything; and I expect others to do the same.

 

Oh boy....

[fiveworlds]

Does poor spelling in our modern data driven world serve as a reasonable proxy for the ignorance/intelligence of the writer?

 

Is it program or programme? cookie or biscuit??? potato or potatoe??

Edited February 25, 2016 by fiveworlds

[dimreepr]

 

Is it program or programme? cookie or biscuit??? potato or potatoe??

 

 

Or is it point or point?

[fiveworlds]

Or is it point or point?

 

or pointe??

[dimreepr]

You seem to be missing this particular point.

[fiveworlds]

You seem to be missing this particular point.

 

Íc am making the point that correct spelling is subjective to where you are. Even here some places expect you to always spell program as programme or potatoe as potato. Making english spelling completely subjective to where you are. I know people who can't spell who have built ships and people who have perfect spelling who would never be able to.

Edited February 25, 2016 by fiveworlds

[iNow]

I recognize that I failed to account for those wherein English is a second language. Clearly, that introduces a bit of a handicap.

 

Likewise, I see some brilliant engineers and mathematicians (and boat builders!) who can't spell to save their lives, but that's largely because they spend their days immersed in a completely different language with different vocabulary and different syntax.

 

I think the idea introduced above by imatfaal about sloppiness and the laziness that a lack of checking/correction from the writer insinuates about them is likely closer to where my head is on this. By example, if you don't bother cleaning your kitchen and utensils or wiping up the tables, then the idea of eating your food or ingesting anything you serve me seems much less appealing than it would were those other items properly handled (no matter how well you combine or prepare the ingredients).

 

The point Robittybob made about practice, experience, and number of posts is also a great one. Clearly, I've got nearly 16,000 posts under my belt at this site plus several thousand more at a few others. That most certainly helps my own performance in this space, and not everyone has that same level of time or inclination or even access.

 

Finally, the point dimreepr made about different types of intelligence resonates with me quite a bit. My suspicion here is that I may value certain of those intelligence types over others and that this might indicate a bias in my thinking... that those more like me are more intelligent than those not, when in reality and based on any reasonable objective measure that's simply inaccurate.

 

Despite all this, like swansont, I make the association, and I tend to do it pretty regularly. I assume certain things about the person based on their spelling. I take mental shortcuts and often treat their position differently as a result.

 

We all make errors, but IMO that should be the exception, not the norm for any individual. When it's a norm, however, I treat it as a knock on the credibility of that individual. I wonder why that is.

Edited February 25, 2016 by iNow

[John Cuthber]

I suspect that, a lot of the time, good spelling indicates the use of a browser with a spell checker built in.

While I accept that I'm probably influenced by bad grammar and spelling, I'd like to think that I base more of my opinion on what is written than on how it is written.

[CharonY]

 

or potatoe as potato.

 

I don't get it. Is it a reference to something?

[John Cuthber]

 

Is it program or programme? cookie or biscuit??? potato or potatoe??

program or programme

Whichever- though some authorities use them to distinguish between computer code and a schedule of events.

"cookie or biscuit"

It depends on which side of the pond you are writing, Though I'm perfectly happy to accept "cookie"- especially as either a given name or as a trade or brand name.

"potato or potatoe"

It's "potato".

Always.

Did you not realise that?

Edited February 25, 2016 by John Cuthber

[Externet]

Senseless English, that beyond having to memorize every word spelling, this crooked contraption of letters were invented :

 

Why writing 'Pronunciation' if writing 'prə-nŭn'-sē-ā′-shən would express it properly ? Some day I hope to find a literature something written entirely with that method / characters, whatever they are called.

[Greg H.]

Poor spelling may not necessarily indicate lower intelligence, but it may make it appear that way to the reader, and sometimes the appearance is more important that the actuality. Additionally, it makes it very hard to understand what's written sometimes.

[iNow]

Perhaps poor spelling/grammar is similar to a speaking impediment or even akin to stuttering when interacting with someone verbally?

[Sirona]

I don't believe there is always a correlation between poor spelling and ignorance. I've worked and studied with a few people who had poor spelling who were above average intelligence. From my understanding people with poor language skills have difficulty putting sounds into written letters and arranging them in the right sequence. It makes it complicated when there are 44 different sounds in the English language but only 26 letters in the alphabet.

I would only consider someone ignorant if they've got a combination of poor spelling, grammar, expression and more importantly if what they have to say is not factual. I'm willing to over look poor language skills if a person is still able to communicate intelligent content. I personally focus on what people. Then there are those with high linguistic intelligence who are able to express themselves eloquently, yet have very little information to communicate. There are many ways to be intelligent and having high linguistic intelligence sometimes I think is a little overrated. Even at school and University most subject areas test your knowledge through written essays and reports and I think it gives those who have high linguistic intelligence an unfair advantage.

However, there certainly are a lot of people who are both uneducated/ignorant and have poor language skills also. I just wouldn't automatically assume it.

[imatfaal]

Perhaps poor spelling/grammar is similar to a speaking impediment or even akin to stuttering when interacting with someone verbally?

 

If we were talking via live Teletype (I used to have to do that via telex inmarsat communication - lots of spelling mistakes and tens of dollar per minute) then I would agree entirely - but nowadays even PM systems have a "press to send" button. There must be a difference (in the measures used to judge the content of the message passed) between a medium which allows a recall of mistakes and one which is instantaneous and live.

[Strange]

There is no real excuse for poor spelling in an on-line environment with instant spell-checking available. Choosing to deliberately not correct errors strikes me as inconsiderate to the reader.