Elite Engineer Posted March 29, 2016 Posted March 29, 2016 So, there's a relatively new member on the OSF, who just happens to be a female, and also just happens to receive an insane amount of positive reputation..considering she's only been here since February, 2016...with approximately 34% of her posts receiving positive feedback. Keep in mind, she has less than 200 posts. Relative to "Resident Expert" members, who have a minimum of 2,000 posts, their positive feedback relative to their number of posts was the following: 5%, 6%, and 29%. I'm not directing my disappointment at this individual..I welcome her to the OSF any day of the week. I am however upset with the male lemmings who feel an urge to provide positive feedback on mostly opinionated posts...with no justifiable expertise or scientific knowledge. I really cherish the OSF, because there are members here who are experts/ PhD's, or who have industry experience...and happily provide that info to whom ever asks. In the real world, obtaining this kind of insight of experience or knowledge comes at a price of either time or money. In ending my rant, I ask that you don't hop on some hormone driven bandwagon and give away positive feedback to someone because their a woman or attractive, but because they provide valuable information and knowledge. Give these people the positive feedback they deserve..appreciate them. However, if I want to gain high, positive reputation..I'll just change my avatar to set of double D's, and change my name to "Alotta Fagina". ~EE -2
CharonY Posted March 29, 2016 Posted March 29, 2016 (edited) What is "OSF"? Also, did you just calculate the ratio of rep points to total posts? If so, very prolific posters are likely to have a less favorable ratio over time as upvotes tend to be rather stochastic in many cases. As you noted, among resident experts the spread can be enormous. There is one poster here with less than 1k posts but usually writes rather well (though I may disagree with the content). The username sounds male and he has got a ratio of ~31%. So your rant seems to be a major concern in the +-3% spread (why didn't you single out that particular individual, the ratio is still higher than most experts/mods?). If you are not only obsessed about rep but about rep ratio, the best way is to post little, but make them quality post. I certainly do not heed that advice and am sure that my ratio is much lower than other experts/mods here. But if I cared about it, it would mean that I actually concern myself with internet points... Edited March 29, 2016 by CharonY 1
Elite Engineer Posted March 29, 2016 Author Posted March 29, 2016 What is "OSF"? OSF = Original Science Forum
Delta1212 Posted March 29, 2016 Posted March 29, 2016 In what way is this disappointing or in any way negatively impacting you, or anyone else for that matter?
swansont Posted March 30, 2016 Posted March 30, 2016 I'm not directing my disappointment at this individual..I welcome her to the OSF any day of the week. I am however upset with the male lemmings who feel an urge to provide positive feedback on mostly opinionated posts...with no justifiable expertise or scientific knowledge. How is it that you are able to discern others' motivations? And please explain how this is not just a sexist rant.
Elite Engineer Posted March 30, 2016 Author Posted March 30, 2016 In what way is this disappointing or in any way negatively impacting you, or anyone else for that matter? Because, this is so typical of any forum, or any online community. Female members always get more attention than male members, because the men are instantly drawn to them. It's disappointing b/c someone is given an overwhelming positive reputation for giving a regular opinion, when everyone does that already. Meanwhile, when a members actually answers a question asked by a post-doc about a specific research topic, that member is usually gets no positive reputation. How is it that you are able to discern others' motivations? And please explain how this is not just a sexist rant. Women with cleavage get more attention than women with no cleavage..do you want me to go into analysis of why?...In short its the same reason a woman on this forum is getting more positive feedback than experts...sounds a bit sexist to me.
CharonY Posted March 30, 2016 Posted March 30, 2016 (edited) So according to your logic a female expert would have much more upvotes than a male one? Also have you looked at experts with less than 2k posts? Edited March 30, 2016 by CharonY
Elite Engineer Posted March 30, 2016 Author Posted March 30, 2016 So according to your logic a female expert would have much more upvotes than a male one? Only if she had an attractive avatar. http://www.techtimes.com/articles/50826/20150505/women-gamers-suffer-from-stereotypes-based-on-their-avatars-attractiveness.htm
Sato Posted March 30, 2016 Posted March 30, 2016 Haha I often don't have much to contribute, but when I do it usually takes a few paragraphs to express. People either appreciate the length or the content—hopefully the latter—and upvote my posts. I prefer to keep threads "unpolluted" so if I want to befriend or attack someone without breaking the chain, I'll PM them. I've also been on SFN for a few years, so reputation aggregates. The combination of these things has led me to a ~1/3 reputation ratio. There are, however, members with thousands of posts and thousands of reputation accordingly, who as far as I remember all have ratios at least as high as those of us who aren't as active around here. It's funny, I noticed heading for Sirona's green button too, for posts which are otherwise neutral in content. I fancy myself unbiased to looks, but it does have a pleasant, homey, feminine tone that other profiles overwhelmingly lack. I saw other posts being lit up green that I wouldn't have expected otherwise, and a general trend thus. This would be a problem if reputation had any actual utility, like money, but it doesn't. I tend to give newer members reputation more regularly, even if I don't have much to say in response, to encourage them to continue writing and show appreciation from the community. People generally need social motivators, and reputation is a good one, and someone becoming reputed for writing great or just okay posts, regardless, will only be encouraged to do so more. And it's certainly a good thing the community's gained another good, active poster around here. If someone came on here spewing obtuse claptrap, I think they'd be given reds regardless of their assumed gender. And thankfully unlike other forums, a user's reputation isn't displayed right beside their name, so we're more inclined to judge a post by its merits than its author's reputation. What's far more important that numeric reputation, as I've seen, is the actual reputation you make for yourself, the impression your writing gives off to the other members of the community. By that, you can expect either a trend of either head-bowing acquiescence or condescending wisecracks in response to your posts here. 2
EdEarl Posted March 30, 2016 Posted March 30, 2016 (edited) Seems like a scientific approach to this thread would be welcomed. IDK if it is possible to get # reputation points and total posts in a spread sheet, but that would provide the raw data, oh yes and sex, M, F, not telling. PS if the thesis of this thread is true, then a male could post a pretty female pic, let sex = not telling and reap the benefit. Edited March 30, 2016 by EdEarl 1
StringJunky Posted March 30, 2016 Posted March 30, 2016 (edited) I vote for many reasons, not just on the quality of posts. I for one will upvote for: well-written and articulate; thoughtful; funny; helpful; exhibits humility ;clever ;novel etc. In short, that person has altered my thoughts/thought patternin some positive way to merit an upvote. Clearly, this lady is doing that for some people. I agree with CharonY, that if one is a prolific poster there post/vote ratio will go down. I have noticed this myself, as I post a fair bit more now than I did in the past. No big deal. To me, the cumulative total means nothing, but someone giving me a green one or red one for a particular post tells me something about how that particular post was received, and in this single context can be nice, or not. .... People generally need social motivators, and reputation is a good one, and someone becoming reputed for writing great or just okay posts, regardless, will only be encouraged to do so more. And it's certainly a good thing the community's gained another good, active poster around here. This is the likely reason for certain newcomers increases... people want them to stick around because they are contributing positively to the forum. Edited March 30, 2016 by StringJunky 3
fiveworlds Posted March 30, 2016 Posted March 30, 2016 (edited) A persons' gender should not in all honesty affect a given members' reputation. Given the fact that most of the members here live a rather large distance apart. Also a given members' relationship status is generally unknown unless a member advertises it. We will rarely if ever see any of the members here so we have no way of telling if they are catfish. I don't really know the genders of any of the members here. For all I know Elite Engineer could be a woman posing as a man because she doesn't like how women are treated on forums. What I do know however is that schools which educate mostly women tend to place a large emphasis on how a person portrays themselves with major expectations on behaviour. Edited March 30, 2016 by fiveworlds 2
zapatos Posted March 30, 2016 Posted March 30, 2016 ...I am however upset with the male lemmings who feel an urge to provide positive feedback on mostly opinionated posts...with no justifiable expertise or scientific knowledge. I really cherish the OSF, because there are members here who are experts/ PhD's, or who have industry experience...and happily provide that info to whom ever asks. In ending my rant, I ask that you don't hop on some hormone driven bandwagon and give away positive feedback to someone because their a woman or attractive, but because they provide valuable information and knowledge. Give these people the positive feedback they deserve..appreciate them. However, if I want to gain high, positive reputation..I'll just change my avatar to set of double D's, and change my name to "Alotta Fagina". ~EE "Opinionated posts" always get the most up votes (or down votes for that matter). Doesn't matter if you are male or female. If you mostly post in Religion, Ethics, and Politics, you are going to get a higher percentage of reputation votes. It never ceases to amaze me how concerned people are about Reputation, although typically they complain that they are treated poorly, rather than someone else being treated too well. Being 'upset' that someone else does well when they don't meet your criteria for praise reeks of jealousy. Thanks for the tips on who I should and should not spend my Reputation votes on, but I'm old enough to make my own decisions. 2
Phi for All Posted March 30, 2016 Posted March 30, 2016 We've had a lot of knowledgeable people join and then leave for whatever reason. Maybe too much speculation, or too many crackpot discussions. When I see newcomers that show promise, I admit I try to upvote their best posts. It's usually not hard, they're some pretty smart and capable people. Some of these people are probably women. I don't go by names and avatars, I go by merit. 3
Endy0816 Posted March 30, 2016 Posted March 30, 2016 While it is true that imagery and text can bias decision making, it is equally true that a number of factors go into why a post receives up/down votes(including 'just because'). I think a more general topic on the subject would be interesting. On the one hand we see chivalry and on the other hand sexism for those choosing to assume a female online persona. Probably not even limited to males(thinking of the results of the Myth Busters test on breast size relation to tips).
StringJunky Posted March 30, 2016 Posted March 30, 2016 Another category of upvotes, I forgot to mention, are the 'me too' upvotes. Used when a post, for whatever reason, doesn't warrant a post in response but where one wishes to show some sort of symbolic, positive acknowledgement or support. It is rather ineffecient, potentially detrimental or tangential to the present flow of conversation, to say "I agree", x number of posts up the road. 3
CharonY Posted March 30, 2016 Posted March 30, 2016 Only if she had an attractive avatar. http://www.techtimes.com/articles/50826/20150505/women-gamers-suffer-from-stereotypes-based-on-their-avatars-attractiveness.htm Wow, Arête must be gorgeous.
fiveworlds Posted March 30, 2016 Posted March 30, 2016 To highlight various differences in male and female education consider this video. https://youtu.be/bOlpK6Yj5a4 Both people are highly educated but male education tends to lack the same emphasis on interpersonal relationship skills. As a result the man leaves a bad impression when he really only wanted to make his point. This is a problem that many men have with religion having little to do with it.
Elite Engineer Posted March 30, 2016 Author Posted March 30, 2016 Wow, Arête must be gorgeous. I said avatar
StringJunky Posted March 30, 2016 Posted March 30, 2016 Wow, Arête must be gorgeous. Indeed. This comes to mind: 2
Sirona Posted March 30, 2016 Posted March 30, 2016 This is very immature and has absolutely nothing to do with sexism but a strategic cover up of sour grapes by means of diversion. This offends me profoundly because you've made little attempt to be ambiguous in your accusation and yet you've not the valiance to even include my name; it's gutless and reflects poorly only on yourself.Rest assured that I am not wanting to win a popularity contest and am indifferent to my rank. I've nothing to prove and you're right about one thing only, I'm inferior to most of you when it comes to scientific knowledge, but I am here to expand on my existing knowledge. I try my best to use evidence-based research when presenting my ideas and don't post unless I have some preliminary knowledge in the area. If you believe my posts are lacking, by all means give them a thumbs down; receiving preferential treatment would be degrading to anyone. I want to be here as an equal and should be able to without having to pretend I am someone I'm not to receive respect and recognition.Why should I not have a profile picture of myself? Some like anonymity and I like transparency; I'd like to know what you all look like too, not because I am interested in any possible sexual pursuit but because I like familiarity. Interaction and connection with people has always been the most important thing for me and that extends to online relationships too. What upsets me most about this post is that you're undermining my integrity without knowing any information about me at all and you've attempted to humiliate me publicly further.I'm not going to disappear with your passive-aggressive attempt at bulling, I'm not going to change my display picture or my mannerisms and I suggest if you have any further problems with me you put it in a PM. 13
imatfaal Posted March 30, 2016 Posted March 30, 2016 ! Moderator Note I think with that excellent post immediately above, which in and of itself refutes the OP, and which expresses the views of many of our members in no uncertain terms it might be time to close this thread. Elite Engineer - please refrain from making threads to discuss an individual member even if you do not name them; it is rude, inconsiderate, and in this case insulting and thus against the rules. I think you will also find that many new members who seem to be approaching the forum in an open, friendly manner through well-written and thoughtful posts will receive a huge amount of up-votes. Personally I will up-vote a new member far more frequently than I would an old-stager. 1
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