Question about radioactive decay.

[Insane]

For a long time, I've had this idea in my head, but never really got around to verifying whether it would work or not. If this works, it would be a perfect way to create Plutonium for you element collectors out there. Unless you're scared (or smart )

 

You would need:

Americium or Radium (Legality Questionable)

U238 (Legal)

Beryllium (Legal)

Borated Parrafin (Legal)

Lead (Legal)

 

Let's say you had a 1'x1' lead block and you drilled 2 holes 3"x3" right next to each other, and you drilled a small drillbit-sized hole connecting the two holes. You put Americium or Radium in Hole #1, along with beryllium coated in borated parrafin, line the lead with aluminum foil. This would generate lots and lots of neutrons. In hole #2, you would put a block of u238. The lead block would then have another block of lead stacked on top of it to seal it up. In theory, the Americium or Radium emit Alpha rays, when these rays come in contact with the Beryllium, it emits neutrons, and since it is coated with Borated Parrafin, the neutrons are slowed down, and flow through the hole connecting to Chamber #2, when these neutrons strike the U238, it decays at a very fast rate, into Neptunium (im unsure of the isotope), then P239.

 

Would this 'transform' or 'decay' the Uranium block into Plutonium?

 

Also, what happens to lead when its is struck with neutrons?

 

My science may not be totally accurate, but I've done lots of reading online so I hope I'm somewhat understandable. Heh, believe it or not, 8th grade science doesn't exactly include nuclear radiation. Stupid school system...

[jdurg]

This has already been done. Do a search for 'David Hahn' and you'll read all about it. The process of doing that is 100% illegal. The manufacture of transuranic elements without full licensing from the NRC can lead to massive fines and imprisonment, not to mention potential lawsuits from anybody in your area who can claim to have been exposed to the radiation. Plus, even after the Pu is formed you would have to physically separate it out from the rest of the junk that will exist in there. Frankly, you'd drop dead in the re-processing.

[budullewraagh]

hahn never made Pu; he used radium-226 and beryllium through tritium (after trying americium-241 and aluminum and failing) on thorium 232, which accepted a neutron and became thorium 233, and decayed to protactinium 233 and finally to uranium 233.

 

the problem is that even if you make plutonium, you'll make the atoms split as soon as they are formed, or so probability says. plus, you have no idea when an atom is going to decay (schrodinger's cat) and without an ultracentrifuge/beast of a mass spectrometer, you can't do anything.

[jdurg]

Hahn didn't make plutonium only because he used thorium and not depleted uranium. Replace his thorium with DU and he has plutonium. The process is 100% exactly the same. As for the atoms splitting as soon as they are formed, that's not really true. The massive quantities of plutonium that we have in this world was formed from the transmutation of U-238 into Pu-239. If it was accurate that the plutonium decays as soon as it is formed, then the idea of a breeder reactor would just be a myth, and plutonium wouldn't exist.

 

Where you are correct is that trying to separate the plutonium from your starting material would require equipment that individuals just cannot afford or have the space to posses. (I think your neighbors would be a bit suspicious if you started builiding a gigantic ultracentrifuge in your backyard. lol).

[budullewraagh]

which is an interesting concept in itself, considering hahn did have urananite ore. good thing he didnt understand solubility rules and ended up with a mixture of the ore and conc H2SO4/HNO3

[Insane]

Since Plutonium is heavier than Uranium, (U238, Pu239) I would have to separate them using a centrifuge. What are the chances, or how long would it take for a pile of uranium dust (bigger surface area, the better, right?) into Pu239, assuming this pile is no more than a couple of grams. (use 3 grams if you're doing mathematical calculations)

 

I'm aware of Hahn, my ideas branched off of his, and I changed em up a little.

[budullewraagh]

you would need to buy an ultracentrifuge (several million US $), and uranium dust wouldnt work. first, youd die. second, and more importantly, the fact that there is a greater surface area doesnt negate the fact that some uranium/plutonium fragments would block some other uranium and so the plutonium in the front would just undergo fission

[jdurg]

When uranium is in a powdered form, it will immediately ignite under common atmospheric conditions and create a massive fire of radioactive material. It would kill you pretty quickly. Plus, the time it takes for the transmutation is on the order of months. The % yield isn't even close to 100%, so not all the uranium becomes plutonium. Some of it fissions from the neutrons, gets split apart when it turns into Neptunium, and some of it splits apart when it turns into Plutonium. So 3 grams may get you about .5 grams of plutonium if you're lucky. (As I said, the % yield isn't all that great).

 

Plus, the separation of the metals requires chemical procedures as well as physical procedures which a human being, heck even some small countries, just cannot afford.

[Insane]

How about chip about 1/5th the size of a dime, just so you can see it, but it's not a hazard. It would work pretty quick, huh? This would be a pretty good sample, I want to start collecting elements, and I was just wondering how dangerous/stupid/practical this is.

 

Plutonium releases radioactive vapors when in a humid environment right? Would it have to be kept in a freezer of some sort?

[jdurg]

Uranium is also a VERY hard metal, so when trying to 'chip it' you would create a fine powder of it and risk it catching on fire. Uranium will also oxidize in the air in a similar manner that neodymium does. Even with a small sample, it takes a great deal of time to transmute it into plutonium. You have to slow the neutrons down to an acceptable speed in order for the uranium to absorb it, and the entire process is not exactly 100% efficient. You would need a HUGE amount in order to get a sizeable sample of plutonium, and the radiation that would be emitted when even trying this would be deadly. There's also the fact that trying to manufacture plutonium is 100%, completely and absolutely illegal. It breaks numerous laws here in the USA and also a few international laws. You will be sent to jail if you attempt to do it and are caught. The only legal ways of doing it require licenses from the NRC and various other federal groups which cost thousands of dollars and would require you to have a certified lab as well. Unless you have a few hundred thousand dollars to spare, it's not worth it.

 

Plutonium is moderately reactive, and after you've irradiated your Uranium for a good long while and then separate out the Pu after a long and dangerous (chemically and radiologically speaking) process, you then need to purify it. Pu will burn like Uranium does in the air, so when you have your fine powder of 0.5 mg Pu at the most, when you try and heat it to melt it into a single piece, it will catch fire and you'll then inhale plutonium oxide particles in the smoke. As a result, you WILL get lung cancer and various other cancers from this. So what I am I trying to say? DON'T DO IT. There is absolutely no benefit to trying to get a sample of plutonium, and the risks involved are akin to inhaling the Ebola Virus in order to try and become immune to it.

[budullewraagh]

it doesnt work. give it up.