B. John Jones Posted May 28, 2016 Posted May 28, 2016 (edited) I propose that the universe is mostly well-lit. Common sense proves (pertaining to the solar system) that nighttime on earth is merely a shallow dome of darkness, a shadow on the underside of the earth. Light dominates the universe. Edited May 28, 2016 by B. John Jones
StringJunky Posted May 28, 2016 Posted May 28, 2016 I propose that the universe is mostly well-lit. Common sense proves (pertaining to the solar system) that nighttime on earth is merely a shallow dome of darkness, a shadow on the underside of the earth. Light dominates the universe. A profound realisation.
B. John Jones Posted May 28, 2016 Author Posted May 28, 2016 A profound realisation. What do you mean?
Daecon Posted May 28, 2016 Posted May 28, 2016 Light does dominate the Universe, but after nearly 14 billion years, the light has cooled down to a temperature of about 2.7 Kelvin and is mostly in the microwave region of the electromagnetic spectrum.
B. John Jones Posted May 28, 2016 Author Posted May 28, 2016 Light does dominate the Universe, but after nearly 14 billion years, the light has cooled down to a temperature of about 2.7 Kelvin and is mostly in the microwave region of the electromagnetic spectrum. Actually, the heavens are mostly full of the friendlier, more colorful lights, but the dome of darkness, and the vengeful sun, mask everything to the naked human eye, except the brighter, whiter, more familiar lights. The sun (the greater governor) is a cruel task master, compared to the gentler, kinder moon, whose governance teeters between the luminous sunlight and the dome, taking his command from the greater light. The fullness of the moon appears when he is just above the dome. Mostly below the dome, he's in his crescent stage, barely breaking through the darkness.
Robittybob1 Posted May 28, 2016 Posted May 28, 2016 .... The fullness of the moon appears when he is just above the dome. Mostly below the dome, he's in his crescent stage, barely breaking through the darkness. Is this suppose to be factual? It doesn't sound right to me. When there is a full moon it is full from the East to the West, so it is also full below the horizon as well in that phase.
B. John Jones Posted May 28, 2016 Author Posted May 28, 2016 Is this suppose to be factual? It doesn't sound right to me. When there is a full moon it is full from the East to the West, so it is also full below the horizon as well in that phase. Consider: 1) concave and convex aspects of the intersecting spheres; 2) vast radial differences of intersecting spheres; 3) transition from darkness to light in the dome of darkness
Robittybob1 Posted May 28, 2016 Posted May 28, 2016 Consider: 1) concave and convex aspects of the intersecting spheres; 2) vast radial differences of intersecting spheres; 3) transition from darkness to light in the dome of darkness Which of those three answers my question?
B. John Jones Posted May 28, 2016 Author Posted May 28, 2016 (edited) Which of those three answers my question? Not meaning to be abrasive, but you're asking the wrong question. The fullness of the moon doesn't have to do with the earth's horizon. When someone below the horizon gazes at the the moon, it is our morning, their dawn. Further along it's very late at night. The moon's fullness doesn't change much in one night from one view. Also, we know that the moon's orbit is an ellipse, which proves my point (the dome is shallow). Edited May 28, 2016 by B. John Jones
Robittybob1 Posted May 28, 2016 Posted May 28, 2016 Not meaning to be abrasive, but you're asking the wrong question. The fullness of the moon doesn't have to do with the earth's horizon. When someone below the horizon gazes at the the moon, it is our morning, their dawn. Further along it's very late at night. The moon's fullness doesn't change much in one night from one view. Also, we know that the moon's orbit is an ellipse, which proves my point (the dome is shallow). How far away do you think the horizon is? If in the morning (at dawn) and you see the full moon you must be looking to the West. So for someone just below the horizon to the West the Moon will be also to their West. They too will be in the morning. Morning and dawn being somewhat similar. I don't think you have proved anything as yet.
Strange Posted May 28, 2016 Posted May 28, 2016 (edited) I propose that the universe is mostly well-lit. Common sense proves (pertaining to the solar system) that nighttime on earth is merely a shallow dome of darkness, a shadow on the underside of the earth. Light dominates the universe. What is it lit by? Why don't space probes that go far from Earth see this? What causes the "dome of darkness"? Why does every planet and satellite (natural and artificial) have such a dome? And common sense doesn't prove anything. Observation frequently shows common sense to be wrong. That is why the scientific process has been so successful. Actually, the heavens are mostly full of the friendlier, more colorful lights, but the dome of darkness, and the vengeful sun, mask everything to the naked human eye, except the brighter, whiter, more familiar lights. So how do you know about these "friendlier" lights? And how can light be "friendly"? What about space telescopes that are not affected by the light from the Sun? Consider: 1) concave and convex aspects of the intersecting spheres; 2) vast radial differences of intersecting spheres; 3) transition from darkness to light in the dome of darkness What spheres are you taking about? What part of a sphere is concave? Also, we know that the moon's orbit is an ellipse, which proves my point (the dome is shallow). Does this mean that you can use the eccentricity of the Moon's orbit to calculate the size of this dome? And does it mean you claim there is a fixed relationship between the phases of the moon and the distance from the moon to the Earth? And how do you account for the fact we see, for example, the shadow of Saturn's moons on Saturn and her rings? Edited May 28, 2016 by Strange
ajb Posted May 28, 2016 Posted May 28, 2016 What can we say -- Yes, the Universe is full of photons -- thread closed?
B. John Jones Posted May 28, 2016 Author Posted May 28, 2016 People who demonstrate a genuine interest in knowing the truth, I have time for. People who disagree just to disagree, I'm sorry, I don't have time for you. -2
Strange Posted May 28, 2016 Posted May 28, 2016 People who demonstrate a genuine interest in knowing the truth, I have time for. Great. Does that mean you will be answering my questions?
B. John Jones Posted May 28, 2016 Author Posted May 28, 2016 What is it lit by? Why don't space probes that go far from Earth see this? What causes the "dome of darkness"? Why does every planet and satellite (natural and artificial) have such a dome? And common sense doesn't prove anything. Observation frequently shows common sense to be wrong. That is why the scientific process has been so successful. So how do you know about these "friendlier" lights? And how can light be "friendly"? What about space telescopes that are not affected by the light from the Sun? What spheres are you taking about? What part of a sphere is concave? Does this mean that you can use the eccentricity of the Moon's orbit to calculate the size of this dome? And does it mean you claim there is a fixed relationship between the phases of the moon and the distance from the moon to the Earth? And how do you account for the fact we see, for example, the shadow of Saturn's moons on Saturn and her rings? Think about it. A big light above. A little ball below. There's going to be a shadow on the underside of the ball. That's our night sky. Great. Does that mean you will be answering my questions? I just did. -1
ajb Posted May 28, 2016 Posted May 28, 2016 People who demonstrate a genuine interest in knowing the truth, I have time for. The truth about what? We know there are plenty of photons in the Universe. We know that the Moon is reflecting light from the Sun. Mod details, what 'truth' are you speaking of? (Also truth may not be the best word here )
Strange Posted May 28, 2016 Posted May 28, 2016 Think about it. A big light above. A little ball below. There's going to be a shadow on the underside of the ball. That's our night sky. Big light above is the Sun? The little ball is the Earth? In which case, that sounds exactly right. As the ball turns the shadow moves and different places experience night. I just did. I'm not sure which question that was an answer to. But there are several others I would be interested to hear your answers to.
B. John Jones Posted May 28, 2016 Author Posted May 28, 2016 (edited) What spheres are you taking about?What part of a sphere is concave? What is it lit by? Why don't space probes that go far from Earth see this? What causes the "dome of darkness"? Why does every planet and satellite (natural and artificial) have such a dome? And common sense doesn't prove anything. Observation frequently shows common sense to be wrong. That is why the scientific process has been so successful. So how do you know about these "friendlier" lights? And how can light be "friendly"? What about space telescopes that are not affected by the light from the Sun? What spheres are you taking about? What part of a sphere is concave? Does this mean that you can use the eccentricity of the Moon's orbit to calculate the size of this dome? And does it mean you claim there is a fixed relationship between the phases of the moon and the distance from the moon to the Earth? And how do you account for the fact we see, for example, the shadow of Saturn's moons on Saturn and her rings? You asked, "What spheres are you taking about? What part of a sphere is concave?" Answer: The moon and the dome. The brightened section of the moon is in the full light of the sun. The darkened section is breaching the dome. Big light above is the Sun? The little ball is the Earth? In which case, that sounds exactly right. As the ball turns the shadow moves and different places experience night. I'm not sure which question that was an answer to. But there are several others I would be interested to hear your answers to. Yes, and the moon stays where the dome goes. The truth about what?We know there are plenty of photons in the Universe. We know that the Moon is reflecting light from the Sun. Mod details, what 'truth' are you speaking of?(Also truth may not be the best word here ) Truth is truth, correct? Edited May 28, 2016 by B. John Jones
ajb Posted May 28, 2016 Posted May 28, 2016 Truth is truth, correct? Well, we don't want to go off topic, but 'truth' is not normally what one is looking for in science. One is looking for models and testing how well they agree with nature. Anyway, as I said, we know that night and day is explained by the Earth's rotation; we know that the Moon reflects light from the Sun; we know that there are plenty of photons in the Universe from all sorts of sources and wavelengths (taking into accound Doppler shift when needed). So, what is it that you want to discuss?
Strange Posted May 28, 2016 Posted May 28, 2016 You asked, "What spheres are you taking about? What part of a sphere is concave?" Answer: The moon and the dome. The brightened section of the moon is in the full light of the sun. The darkened section is breaching the dome. I assume the "dome" you refer to is the shadow of the Earth that you described in the previous post. It is actually a cone, rather than a dome (as some simple geometry will show). In which case, you seem to be talking about an eclipse, rather than the phases of the Moon. The phases of the Moon are caused by the fact that, as you described above, it is a small ball illuminated by a large light (the Sun) and so the other side of it is shadowed.
swansont Posted May 28, 2016 Posted May 28, 2016 I propose that the universe is mostly well-lit. Common sense proves (pertaining to the solar system) that nighttime on earth is merely a shallow dome of darkness, a shadow on the underside of the earth. Light dominates the universe. Define well-lit. Earth is a poor reference for this, because we are fairly close to a light source. Much of the universe is not, and the brightness drops off with the square of the distance.
B. John Jones Posted May 28, 2016 Author Posted May 28, 2016 Well, we don't want to go off topic, but 'truth' is not normally what one is looking for in science. One is looking for models and testing how well they agree with nature. Anyway, as I said, we know that night and day is explained by the Earth's rotation; we know that the Moon reflects light from the Sun; we know that there are plenty of photons in the Universe from all sorts of sources and wavelengths (taking into accound Doppler shift when needed). So, what is it that you want to discuss? Why should we assume the space around the moon is dim or dark when the moon is so brilliant at night? It's brilliance proves otherwise.
Strange Posted May 28, 2016 Posted May 28, 2016 Why should we assume the space around the moon is dim or dark when the moon is so brilliant at night? It's brilliance proves otherwise. It is only "brilliant" on one side. The other side is unlit. (Don't forget, several nations have sent probes to orbit the Moon.)
ajb Posted May 28, 2016 Posted May 28, 2016 Why should we assume the space around the moon is dim or dark when the moon is so brilliant at night? It's brilliance proves otherwise. I don't understand. Who says that the space around the Moon is dim? This seems very poor wording.
B. John Jones Posted May 28, 2016 Author Posted May 28, 2016 Define well-lit. Earth is a poor reference for this, because we are fairly close to a light source. Much of the universe is not, and the brightness drops off with the square of the distance. I'm sure that most of us here have seen images of the varieties of colored systems, such as the galaxies, and the vast physical phenomena of the heavens. We're most familiar with bright, white light. But the universe is much richer with light. These images in themselves are majestic. How much more majesty should we expect the further we venture beyond the harsh light of the sun? How much richer was your experience breathing in the fresh air of protected regions of the earth than when you viewed an image of our globe? Sunlight as well as darkness mask multitudes of details, whether darkness is the shadow cast by the earth, or another shallow dome over a much grander surface.
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