"Irrational ideologies of the left"

[MigL]

But in post #45 you said the problems which Tampitump was alarmed about 'don't actually exist'.

Now you concede that there could be corruption, abuse and misapplication.

 

Why not simply say its a valid and valuable concept, but if corrupted, abused or misapplied, COULD lead to the silencing of dissenting opinions ?

[John Cuthber]

And if you'd bothered to read that NYT article, you would have found within it, links to several examples within academic institutions where the safe space concept has been corrupted, abused or misapplied.

If I read the NYT, will I find examples of academic institutions where the ideas of Capitalism are also "corrupted, abused or misapplied."?

Edited September 19, 2016 by John Cuthber

[Strange]

Why not simply say its a valid and valuable concept, but if corrupted, abused or misapplied, COULD lead to the silencing of dissenting opinions ?

 

 

That would fine if Tampitump were complaining about the corruption or abuse of the system. He is objecting to the very concept.

And Tampitytump is suggesting you can't stay in the safe space forever.

 

I don't think anyone is suggesting you can.

 

Eventually you have to leave the security of the college/university and go out in the real world.

More importantly, eventually you have to leave the security of the safe space and go out into the college/university and get on with your course, social life, etc.

[swansont]

But in post #45 you said the problems which Tampitump was alarmed about 'don't actually exist'.

145? That was a response to a link that was a litany of straw men and contained no actual examples of how safe spaces allegedly restricted free speech. No evidence was presented that the alleged problems in the article actually exist.

 

Now you concede that there could be corruption, abuse and misapplication.

 

Why not simply say its a valid and valuable concept, but if corrupted, abused or misapplied, COULD lead to the silencing of dissenting opinions ?

I thought that went without saying. If you can name an institution/ideology that has not ever been corrupted, abused or misapplied, then you might have a point. The problems don't exist because of the system. They exist because someone has appropriated it. They are not institutional shortcomings. If you disbanded a practice because someone has on occasion corrupted it, all of your favorite institutions would have to go away.

 

But as this thread is based on the assertion that this is an irrational ideology, I'm not the one you have to convince — something that is a valid and valuable concept is not irrational. In pointing to these issues, the clear implication is that they are seen as systemic flaws, and that's what I'm trying to refute.

[MigL]

But we're not discussing capitalism here, John.

And 'if you disbanded a practice because someone has on occasion corrupted it, all your favorite institutions would have to go away' sounds good, Swansont, but I've never heard you express that sentiment in a thread about religion.

( thanks for the correction BTW; yes, post #145 )

 

Note also that I'm not making Tampitump's argument for him; I'm expressing my own views.

I'm not objecting to the concept.

Edited September 19, 2016 by MigL

[swansont]

But we're not discussing capitalism here, John.

And 'if you disbanded a practice because someone has on occasion corrupted it, all your favorite institutions would have to go away' sounds good, Swansont, but I've never heard you express that sentiment in a thread about religion.

( thanks for the correction BTW; yes, post #145 )

 

 

Perhaps you just haven't looked hard enough. There's a current thread here in politics where I've done that very thing (to wit, the institution of Islam should not be blamed for the acts of terrorists, just as Christianity as an institution is not accountable for the KKK)

[Tampitump]

After three days off, I've had some time to reflect on my positions. I suppose that my position is based on a hypothetical slippery slope, and it is the concepts which I reject rather than the current effects of their practice. Even if I concede that there is no evidence for Negative effects of safe spaces, I still cannot bring myself to support the concept. I do not envision a reality wherein these things result in benefit to the free exchange of ideas, or even the overall benefit of minorities. But when you're trying to hang with the big boys in debate, its important to admit when your evidence reserves have run dry, so I'm here to make that admission.

[swansont]

!

Moderator Note

 

Note: the BLM discussion has been split

http://www.scienceforums.net/topic/98730-irrational-ideologies-of-the-left-blm/

 

[MigL]

Sorry if BLM was off-topic.

But was it not one of the original ideologies mentioned by Tampitump, along with safe spaces, feminism and Islam ?

Should it not have been left here for 'continuation' ?

[swansont]

Sorry if BLM was off-topic.

But was it not one of the original ideologies mentioned by Tampitump, along with safe spaces, feminism and Islam ?

Should it not have been left here for 'continuation' ?

 

 

 

It was also my request that we focus on one issue, and after some muddling around (and not getting an answer) I chose safe spaces.