Free energy.

[Logic and Theory]

I would like to talk about the free energy magnetic motor. Many people have been able to consruct devices that use the energy magnets generate to soon different kinds of electric generators. There are several examples if you search "free energy motor" on YouTube.

In all of the videos I have watched, every free energy motor is turned on via manual mechanical interference. I would like to propose a hybrid stationary electromagnet with conventional magnets afixed a rotor. the system will be first applied to charging 12vdc car batteries via alternator. The plan is to move up to the higher voltage hybrid and electric batteries on the second stage.

 

Altenators put out a constant 14.4vdc thanks to a device called a stator. That means the goal is that the free energy motor provide enough torque to soon the alternator at the desires rpm to produce electricity to charge the system without using more than 12vdc. The only "free" energy in this test will come from the high powered man made magnets. The hybrid electro magnets hooked to a mechanical voltage regulator provide the ability to control the available force on the fixed magnets.This allows for is to stop the system and regulate its speed.

The goal is to ultimately be able to charge batteries on the go independently of fossil fuels. Eventually, with high effeciency inverters, we could cut down on some of the energy consumption in our homes.

please let me know your thoughts.

[Ken Fabian]

my thoughts? These 'free' energy devices sound like a version of a perpetual motion machine, but there are good reasons why they don't ever run continously or produce more energy than was initially put into them. The output of an alternator or generator will be equal to the energy the motor driving it uses minus the waste heat from friction and other inefficiencies. The output of the generator will not be enough to power the motor under load and the combination will run down and stop.

 

I suggest looking up the law of Conservation of Energy or First Law of Thermodynamics.

 

The best "free" energy devices are things like photovoltaics that turn an existing abundant energy source that we don't use into a form of energy we can - and even those will never be entirely free and don't ever make more energy than was there in the first place.

[pzkpfw]

... devices that use the energy magnets generate ...

Magnets do not generate energy.

 

The energy you get from an alternator or dynamo comes from the energy put in to turn it.

[Logic and Theory]

my thoughts? These 'free' energy devices sound like a version of a perpetual motion machine, but there are good reasons why they don't ever run continously or produce more energy than was initially put into them. The output of an alternator or generator will be equal to the energy the motor driving it uses minus the waste heat from friction and other inefficiencies. The output of the generator will not be enough to power the motor under load and the combination will run down and stop.

 

I suggest looking up the law of Conservation of Energy or First Law of Thermodynamics.

 

The best "free" energy devices are things like photovoltaics that turn an existing abundant energy source that we don't use into a form of energy we can - and even those will never be entirely free and don't ever make more energy than was there in the first place.

My version is specifically not a perpetual motion device. The device starts when a current is introduced to provide the electro magnets with polarity, and the device stops when the current is taken away.

 

Magnetic fields can be manipulated to generate kinetic energy. No other energy has to be introduced for this to happen. 2 similar poles N+N or S+S will push away from one another for years. The force of these fields will outlast the device. My suggested design is just a variation of several magnet motor generators that do work.

 

conservation of energy.

My design converts the magnetic field's energy into kinetic energy. The kinetic energy is then used to charge a battery.

This has been done with foam cutouts and small hobby store magnets.

There is a minor complication of how much energy will be lost/used due to friction and the resistance of the armateur that essentially is the reverse of my magnet motor. While this poses a problem, it's hardly impossible to overcome. for the beta test, I may have to use more magnets than desires for practical applications.

 

I could independently develop the motor to put out a specific torque at 12vdc or less. The specific torque goal would be set by providing power to the field of the alternator, and measuring the inch lbs required to rotate the shaft. Without power to the field of the alternator there is little to no resistance. The magnet motor does not have to generate said torque at low RPM. The motor could be move at a desires RPM before introducing current to the field.

 

source for information on alternators

 

https://www.alternatorparts.com/understanding-alternators.html

 

source for magnet motors

 

http://fuel-efficient-vehicles.org/energy-news/?page_id=976

I would like to add that I am not posing a fafetched idea of an unlimited energy source. This idea is just a practical adaptation of a machine to essentially allow an electric car to travel a greater distance, before needing a charge, without using fossil fuels.

The current electric cars can travel in the 80 mile range on a full charge. The hybrid models that use has powered generators to charge the batteries can double the range. For many people, who have frequent commutes greater than 200 miles, this is not a practical mode of transportation.

Even if a device such as the one I have proposed Only generates enough charge to extend the current range by a factor of 25%. It may be enough to make the difference for enough drivers to make the switch to cleaner transportation.

I would like to add that I am not posing a fafetched idea of an unlimited energy source. This idea is just a practical adaptation of a machine to essentially allow an electric car to travel a greater distance, before needing a charge, without using fossil fuels.

The current electric cars can travel in the 80 mile range on a full charge. The hybrid models that use has powered generators to charge the batteries can double the range. For many people, who have frequent commutes greater than 200 miles, this is not a practical mode of transportation.

Even if a device such as the one I have proposed Only generates enough charge to extend the current range by a factor of 25%. It may be enough to make the difference for enough drivers to make the switch to cleaner transportation.

Edited September 28, 2016 by Logic and Theory

[Fuzzwood]

So you are using an electric motor to drive an alternator. Why not charge the batteries directly and save the losses from resistance, friction and heat?

[Logic and Theory]

The magnet motor is mechanically riven by opposing magnetic poles. The electricity introduced is merely a speed limiter. It gives the system the ability to start and stop with a switch.

another simple way to charge the batteries of an electric car would be to install a pedal generator in the car. Have (a) passenger(s) pedal to manually provide the power needed to drive with an extended range.

But again, the magnet motor is neither an electric motor, not is it a perpetual motion device

[Strange]

Magnetic fields can be manipulated to generate kinetic energy. No other energy has to be introduced for this to happen. 2 similar poles N+N or S+S will push away from one another for years.

 

 

No they can't.

 

If the 2 poles are constantly pushing then that says they are not moving apart and so there is no kinetic energy generated. If they push each other apart then the force drops of rapidly. The kinetic energy to move the magnets apart comes from the energy you provided to bring them together in the first place (minus losses).

 

There is no free energy from magnets. (I can't believe I am having to say that.)

 

 

My suggested design is just a variation of several magnet motor generators that do work.

 

Of course there are magnetic motors that work - because they use electrical energy.

 

If you think there are motors that work by extracting energy from magnets then you have been fooled.

 

(And even if you could extract the energy from magnets, that would mean they would no longer be magnetic.)

[Logic and Theory]

https://youtu.be/jiAhiu6UqXQ

 

here is a very simple example.

If you construct a framework to hold the drive magnet in the optimal position relative to the fan, where does the energy come from?

[DrP]

The magnets will eventually die and it will take more energy to remake them than you get out of them.

 

Also - you need to apply a force to the magnet that drives the motor to hold it into place - which is being provided by the person in the video by holding it.... the energy needed to provide that force by the person (i.e the food he eats to power his muscles) will be far higher than the puny electric current generated that powers the light.

Oh - PS - you cant just have a frame to hold the 'drive' magnet as the thing will not work like that. When the thing starts turning there is the attractive force to overcome from the other poles - the man in the film can subtly influence this so it only drives forward by pulling back a bit and pushing forwards very slightly to over come the effect - some people get around this problem by having an electromagnet which switches on and off at the right moments so the propeller only experiences the push and not the pull of the magnets, but this doesn't work either as you need power in order for the electro magnet to work.

 

The guy in the video probably knows this and is either hoaxing people for fun or for funding.... or maybe he is just un aware of his errors... otherwise, why hasn't he built a generator already and made millions? Answer: he is either a con man/trickster or a fool.

[Logic and Theory]

The pull effect can be dampened by introducing maggnetic tampering materials such as copper to the areas between the poles that push. my design does incorporate electromagents.

The magnets will ware down, but the new magnets do not have to be charges with fossil fuels.

My model has not been attempted in any of the resigns I have researched. So basically it must remain plausible until its proven wrong.

[Mordred]

The pull effect can be dampened by introducing maggnetic tampering materials such as copper to the areas between the poles that push. my design does incorporate electromagents.

The magnets will ware down, but the new magnets do not have to be charges with fossil fuels.

My model has not been attempted in any of the resigns I have researched. So basically it must remain plausible until its proven wrong.

In order to be plausible it must obeys the laws of physics. You have not shown plausibility. One can counter a model as implausible long before testing by applying the well tested laws of physics.

 

You have not done so.

 

The law of physics your ignoring is the conservation of energy laws. Which in itself invalidates free energy...

Edited September 28, 2016 by Mordred

[Logic and Theory]

ok..

 

free energy is a mind teaser. It gets you interested in the post.

My idea clearly manipulates available energy.

You are correct. In some models the rotor will stop,balances between the poles. To prevent this, the device can not be symetrical in design. The distance ratios for the overlapping fields would need to be set to an irational number.

 

I will be testing soon. I will use the scientific method. Hopefully get my work peer reviewed and published. The only law of physics challenges her is the ratio of energy produced to the amount used

[DrP]

QUOTE: "the magnets will wear down.... do not need to be recharged using fossil fuels"

 

But DO need recharging...... and this charging will take more energy that you got out of the system in the first place, so the energy is not free, it will require more work putting in than you get out. Are you getting this yet? I am sure anyone who knows what they are talking about would have told you the same thing over and over.

 

It is like trying to pour 2 pints of beer from a single pint glass.... no matter how you try to do it you will only get 1 pint out of that one glass.... you will never get 1.2 pints from it because there is only 1 pint in there to begin with. Energy is quantised.

 

QUOTE: "free energy is a mind teaser"..

Not really - it is well understood and NONE of these you-tube vids actually work - they are tricks or mistakes.... as you yourself will find out if you continue with this lost cause. No amount of testing or tweaking or using irrational numbers instead of regular spacings is going to change this unfortunately.

Edited September 28, 2016 by DrP

[Strange]

My model has not been attempted in any of the resigns I have researched. So basically it must remain plausible until its proven wrong.

Er, no, that is not how science (or even real life) works.

 

You idea is contradicted by fundamental and well-tested scientific principles. Therefore it remains impossible until you can show that all of established physics is wrong.

 

If generating free power were so easy then there would be a huge industry around it and a number of very rich people, as well as lots of small scale setups in every every house and on every street.

 

And you can't really claim that it doesn't happen because "Big Oil" is trying to stop it when it is on yootoob and every science forum.

[Logic and Theory]

obviously this forum does not have room for connotation.

Clarification,

Not "free energy" Energy may be coverted from one type to another using some of the available energy from the beginning in the process at every change. And energy is lost/used from friction and resistance.

I'm not crazy I promise.

Everyone insists on my device creating more energy than it uses to operate. I must insist that it uses and loses energy it has to charge a battery to extend range. charging magnets can be done with hand cranking a small generator. My proposal is an alternative, not a infinite solution. Its not a magical proposition that changesbtge world. It does not contradict proven physics IF the device loses the energy it gives to the battery. energy is lost so that the battery may propel the car for a longer time. How much longer is the test.

Perhaps a passenger mounted pedal charger would be more effecient. India is working on a system to charge batteries for individual household's via pedal power. They say an hour of peddling will charge a battery enough to provide power to a house for 1 day. Thank you for all of your responses. Sorry to have misled you with the title "free energy" . It was used to grab your attention.

interesting video

We can convert kinetic energy to electricity with moving water. Chemical energy is used in batteries. We can make energy from matter with nuclear. magnets are used to create armateurs in generators. But physics stands wrong that magnets can not yield energy. It is entirely possible that I'm wrong.could someone provide a source to educate me on how there is no energy stores in magnets?

Edited September 28, 2016 by Logic and Theory

[Strange]

Clarification,

Not "free energy"

 

 

Then why do you keep linking to crackpot "free energy" videos?

 

 

 

Energy may be coverted from one type to another using some of the available energy from the beginning in the process at every change.

 

Then where is the energy coming from?

[Logic and Theory]

The links are other examples of using magnetism to exploit the provided stored energy. The energy is used more slowly by the magnets. Once the available energy is deminished, the device must be given more energy to operate.

The energy comes from stored energy. In the first video someone commented that the person must manipulate the magnet to maintain the spin. He then said a solid frame could not do this. I can agree with that. If you introduce more stores energy in the form of a spring that would possibly be able to manipulate the orientation of the magnet. The result would be longer. automated spinning using the stores energy in the spring.

My question of the energy stored in magnets was not addressed.

[swansont]

The links are other examples of using magnetism to exploit the provided stored energy. The energy is used more slowly by the magnets. Once the available energy is deminished, the device must be given more energy to operate.

The energy comes from stored energy. In the first video someone commented that the person must manipulate the magnet to maintain the spin. He then said a solid frame could not do this. I can agree with that. If you introduce more stores energy in the form of a spring that would possibly be able to manipulate the orientation of the magnet. The result would be longer. automated spinning using the stores energy in the spring.

My question of the energy stored in magnets was not addressed.

Your links have been to people posting perpetual motion/free energy devices, so they are bad examples to point to if you are merely proposing a generator of some sort. You should stop doing that. I can edit the title of the thread, if you wish, to avoid confusion.

 

As for the energy stored in a magnet

https://van.physics.illinois.edu/qa/listing.php?id=17858

 

"a large field (3000 G) over 1000 cm³ would have about 4x10⁸ ergs or 40 J. That's about 1/100,000 of a kWh."

 

You should see the magnet weaken noticeably in your device, in a short time, if that's where the energy is coming from. You can also calculate how long a known load should be supported. Those are things you can easily test.

 

[koti]

https://youtu.be/jiAhiu6UqXQ

 

here is a very simple example.

If you construct a framework to hold the drive magnet in the optimal position relative to the fan, where does the energy come from?

 

I can tell you where the energy to power the fan and the bulb in this video comes from. From a small battery hidden inside one of the corners of the fan.

Edited September 28, 2016 by koti

[wayne_m]

If you look at the base of the bulb, you will see the hoax. It can unscrew from the plastic globe to insert a battery.